[swift-evolution] Swift phases and mis-timed proposals

[Xiaodi Wu]

On Sun, Jun 11, 2017 at 4:41 PM, Haravikk via swift-evolution <
swift-evolution at swift.org> wrote:

>
> On 11 Jun 2017, at 22:13, Gor Gyolchanyan via swift-evolution <
> swift-evolution at swift.org> wrote:
>
> I agree, this makes focusing on the right types of changes much easier and
> helps us avoid turning Swift into an incoherent conglomeration of random
> use-cases (*cough*, C#, *cough*).
> Now, the question is: when will be the time to officially push the factory
> initializers proposal and which stage should it be targeting?
>
>
> I think there's definitely a need for greater clarity; we could really do
> with better announcements on the list itself as to when the new phase
> begins and *exactly* what is in-scope, it also needs to be put more
> clearly on the swift-evolution repository.
>
> Thing is; people are going to have ideas when they have them, and want to
> discuss them right away. I've been caught out numerous times with proposals
> that are almost immediately rejected as out of scope, and still have no
> idea when I'm supposed to resubmit them.
>
> To be honest it's demoralising, as I find myself apathetic towards my own
> ideas as I have no idea when to revisit them, and by the time I do I've
> largely lost interest and moved on to other things.
>

I think many of us who've tried our hand at getting proposals through the
process have experienced the setback of a potential worthwhile idea not
receiving an audience. Yet, on balance, I still think the process handles
out-of-scope ideas appropriately.

A key question here to be answered is: is this mailing list the appropriate
forum for "discussing ideas right away," whatever they might be? or is it
more of a working list for bringing forward in-scope proposals in the
successive forms of pitch, draft, and proposal review? As far as I can
tell, the aim of scoping rules is to nudge it towards the latter, and
personally I think that's quite nice in terms of bringing sanity back to my
inbox as well as focus to the discussions. By contrast, I have seen blogs,
Twitter, and other channels used profitably for discussing ideas right
away, and personally I've found off-list communications to be the best way
to prepare for the much more difficult task of convincing the discerning
crowd here.
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