[swift-users] [swift-evolution] Plan to move swift-evolution and swift-users mailing lists to Discourse

Joshua Alvarado alvaradojoshua0 at gmail.com
Thu Feb 9 17:11:41 CST 2017

The decision to move from the mailing list may have surprised many but the
discussion on it has been ongoing very strong. Sorry you feel like you
didn't get to voice your opinion which I believe everyone should have the
opportunity to. I think many agree that email has it's perks on iPhone and
iPad but many have advocated for Disclosure because a way to improve  the
Swift community's communication. It is very hard to please every person in
the community with each change but as a community we should support each
other in the discussions and decisions that are put forth (agreeing or
not). I believe we can find a way to get the experience with Disclosure.
Get it best for iPhone and iPad users, as well as email support and those
who want to just use Disclosure only. This may not all happen at once but
it will come as we progress.

On Thu, Feb 9, 2017 at 10:30 AM, Matthew Johnson via swift-evolution <
swift-evolution at swift.org> wrote:

> On Feb 9, 2017, at 11:16 AM, Jens Alfke via swift-users <
> swift-users at swift.org> wrote:
> On Feb 9, 2017, at 3:41 AM, Jan Neumüller via swift-users <
> swift-users at swift.org> wrote:
> I would prefer http://www.fudforum.org/ that has good mailing list
> support, too.
> Well, we appear to have completely opposite opinions on UI/usability. I
> took a look at fudforum and yeah, to my eyes it exemplifies the awful
> clutter that’s been a hallmark of web forums since before PHPBB. There’s so
> much visual noise it’s very hard to parse or to find anything. Clearly
> designed by a coder with a big hammer named “<table>”. I’m not a UI
> designer, but I’ve worked extensively with UI designers (I spent 15 years
> at Apple working on stuff like iChat and AppleScript) so I think I have
> some grounding in the field.
> I do believe, though, that *whatever solution swift.org
> <http://swift.org/> switches to needs to have good email support*. That
> way the people who hate the web UI, or who just don’t prefer to use the web
> for discussions, can keep using email as we do today. This is perfectly
> feasible to do; again, groups.io is a good example.
> Here my concern is that *I have not found a way to configure Discourse to
> make its email notifications work well as a substitute for a mailing list.*
> I have admin privileges on a Discourse installation run by my employer, so
> I’ve looked through the entire admin UI for ways to improve the emails, and
> some of the problems don’t seem fixable by tweaking settings.
> At this point I’m going to shut up because it sounds like the decision has
> been made, and I don’t want to contribute to further bike-shedding.
> I’ve been mostly silent in this conversation largely because I didn’t
> realize it was leading up to a formal decision.  I wish it would have
> followed the proposal process so it was clear to everyone that a decision
> was being considered and this was our chance to offer input.
> I really like the experience of participating in the community via email.
> If I knew a decision was being seriously considered I would have taken a
> closer look at Discourse and likely offered more input.  I will be
> disappointed if the experience of participating is not at least as good as
> it is using email.
> One of the most important reasons I like using email is that Mail offers a
> great experience on iPhone and iPad.  I am skeptical that a web-based forum
> could offer the same level of convenience and efficiency for keeping up
> with the community that email provides.
> I hope that we do find a way to configure our tool (probably Discourse) so
> that the email experience on iPhone and iPad does not suffer.  If we can
> meet that criteria and *also* offer the advantages of a web-based tool I
> will be very happy.  But I think the current email experience on iPhone and
> iPad should set a minimum criteria that any tool must meet.
> —Jens
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> _______________________________________________
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> https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution

Joshua Alvarado
alvaradojoshua0 at gmail.com
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