<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Apr 10, 2017, at 9:49 AM, Tino Heth via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8" class=""><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">But even outside the generated code use cases, it's nice to just be able to implement helpers or additional "convenience" conformances in separate files named appropriately (like "Type+Protocol.swift" or "Type+Helpers.swift"). I find it makes my codebase easier to navigate.</div></div></blockquote><div class="">No doubt about the usefulness of having separate files with extensions here</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"><div class="gmail_msg" style="word-wrap: break-word;"><div class="gmail_msg">If nothing else, nested extensions could save those who actually don't care much about such issues from another breaking change in Swift — and imho it adds consistency:</div><div class="gmail_msg">We can nest types, so why can't we nest extensions?</div></div></blockquote><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br class=""></div><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Because types and extensions are quite different beasts, so something that applies to one doesn't necessarily apply to the other. </div></blockquote><div class="">I don't buy this argument at all without an objective explanation why the curly braces of extensions should be treated different than the curly braces of types…</div></div></div></div></blockquote>Extensions are not Partials. <br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div class=""><div class=""><br class=""></div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">I don't think that holds its weight. This feels like another case of "let's try to satisfy everyone who's unhappy with some part of Swift visibility by changing a completely different feature to make things fall into place", which I don't think is a sound motivation or design principle. The example you posted in your initial message weaves multiple types/nesting levels together in a way that looks *incredibly* difficult to follow/parse to even an experienced user of the language.</div></blockquote><div class="">Did you noticed that I started this example as mockery? In real life, I would hopefully never nest more than once… and do you think sprinkling parts of class over the project is easier to follow?</div></div></div></div></blockquote>Extensions are not Partials. <br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Everyone seems to be striving for a "perfect" level of access control that lets individual types/members dictate precisely what other types/members can access them. I'm not sure if that perfection is attainable or not, but even if it is, I don't think it's something we should strive for. I'd rather have a simple visibility model that leaks a little than an air-tight model that allows people to write overly complicated code for the sake of fine-tuning access.</div></blockquote><div class="">I had no desire to change the model of Swift 2 — but apparently, others thought it wasn't sufficient, and I'd rather prefer a conceptually simple model like nesting over a complicated one with less power.</div></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Let's remember that the core team has limited resources to implement the things we propose, and if I have to choose between, say, serialization, reflection, asynchronous constructs, and rehashing visibility levels yet again, it's clear to me which one I would want dropped on the floor. I don't want perfect to be the enemy of good.</div></div></blockquote></div>Well, right now, there are several (at least one ;-) proposals that aim for a breaking change of the whole model… nested extensions break nothing, so it can be delayed for as long as the core team likes, without causing any trouble.</div></div></blockquote>Partials limited to the same scope can do the same with out having to give extension special nesting powers :)<br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">_______________________________________________<br class="">swift-evolution mailing list<br class=""><a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a><br class="">https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution<br class=""></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></body></html>