<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">The review of SE-0164 "Remove final support in protocol extensions"</span></div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><blockquote type="cite"><ul class="" style="box-sizing: border-box; padding-left: 2em; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px;"><li class="" style="box-sizing: border-box;"><font color="#000000"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">What is your evaluation of the proposal?</span></font></li></ul></blockquote><div id="AppleMailSignature">The present situation isn't great. People get confused about which method will called with protocol extensions. Seems like every week there is a variation on this confusion on Swift Users mailing list. Therefore something needs to be done. </div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div><div id="AppleMailSignature">However I am not keen on this proposal since it makes behaviour inconsistent between methods in protocol extensions, classes, and structs. </div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div><div id="AppleMailSignature">I think a better solution would be one of the following alternatives:</div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div><div id="AppleMailSignature"> 1. Must use final and final means it cannot be overridden; or</div><div id="AppleMailSignature"> 2. If not final dispatches using a table like a class and if marked final cannot be overridden and if marked dynamic uses obj-c dispatching; or</div><div id="AppleMailSignature"> 3. Must be marked dynamic and uses obj-c dispatching. </div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div><div id="AppleMailSignature">My preference would be option 2 but I think any of the three is superior to the present situation or the proposal. </div><br><blockquote type="cite"><ul class="" style="box-sizing: border-box; padding-left: 2em; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px;"><li class="" style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0.25em;"><font color="#000000"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">Is the problem being addressed significant enough to warrant a change to Swift?</span></font></li></ul></blockquote><div id="AppleMailSignature">Yes. Causes no end of confusion and is inconsistent. </div><br><blockquote type="cite"><ul class="" style="box-sizing: border-box; padding-left: 2em; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px;"><li class="" style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0.25em;"><font color="#000000"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">Does this proposal fit well with the feel and direction of Swift?</span></font></li></ul></blockquote><div id="AppleMailSignature">Fixing the current behaviour yes, but not the proposal since it is inconsistent with the rest of the language. </div><br><blockquote type="cite"><ul class="" style="box-sizing: border-box; padding-left: 2em; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px;"><li class="" style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0.25em;"><font color="#000000"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">If you have used other languages or libraries with a similar feature, how do you feel that this proposal compares to those?</span></font></li></ul></blockquote><div id="AppleMailSignature">Yes. Languages like Java and Scala use a method similar to option 2 above. But not something like the proposal. </div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><ul class="" style="box-sizing: border-box; padding-left: 2em; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px;"><li class="" style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0.25em;"><font color="#000000"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">How much effort did you put into your review? A glance, a quick reading, or an in-depth study?</span></font></li></ul></blockquote>Have suffered at the hands of the present behaviour when learning Swift. <br><br>-- Howard. </div><div><br>On 6 Apr 2017, at 8:05 am, Douglas Gregor <<a href="mailto:dgregor@apple.com">dgregor@apple.com</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=us-ascii"><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(36, 41, 46); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">Hello Swift community,</p><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(36, 41, 46); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">The review of SE-0164 "Remove final support in protocol extensions" begins now and runs through April 8, 2017. The proposal is available here:</p><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px 0px 16px; padding: 0px 1em; border-left-width: 0.25em; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(223, 226, 229); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><div style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class=""><font color="#6a737d" face="-apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, Segoe UI, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, Apple Color Emoji, Segoe UI Emoji, Segoe UI Symbol" size="3" class=""><a href="https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/proposals/0164-remove-final-support-in-protocol-extensions.md" class="">https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/proposals/0164-remove-final-support-in-protocol-extensions.md</a></font></div></blockquote><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(36, 41, 46); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">Reviews are an important part of the Swift evolution process. All reviews should be sent to the swift-evolution mailing list at</p><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px 0px 16px; padding: 0px 1em; color: rgb(106, 115, 125); border-left-width: 0.25em; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(223, 226, 229); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><div style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class=""><a href="https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution" style="box-sizing: border-box; background-color: transparent; -webkit-text-decoration-skip: objects; color: rgb(3, 102, 214); text-decoration: none;" class="">https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution</a></div></blockquote><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(36, 41, 46); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">or, if you would like to keep your feedback private, directly to the review manager. When replying, please try to keep the proposal link at the top of the message:</p><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px 0px 16px; padding: 0px 1em; border-left-width: 0.25em; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(223, 226, 229); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><p style="color: rgb(106, 115, 125); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px;" class="">Proposal link:</p><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding: 0px 1em; border-left-width: 0.25em; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(223, 226, 229);" class=""><div style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class=""><font color="#6a737d" face="-apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, Segoe UI, Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, Apple Color Emoji, Segoe UI Emoji, Segoe UI Symbol" size="3" class=""><a href="https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/proposals/0164-remove-final-support-in-protocol-extensions.md" class="">https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/proposals/0164-remove-final-support-in-protocol-extensions.md</a></font></div></blockquote></blockquote><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px 0px 16px; padding: 0px 1em; color: rgb(106, 115, 125); border-left-width: 0.25em; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(223, 226, 229); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><div style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class="">Reply text</div></blockquote><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px 0px 16px; padding: 0px 1em; color: rgb(106, 115, 125); border-left-width: 0.25em; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(223, 226, 229); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding: 0px 1em; border-left-width: 0.25em; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(223, 226, 229);" class=""><div style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class="">Other replies</div></blockquote></blockquote><h5 style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 24px; margin-bottom: 16px; font-size: 0.875em; line-height: 1.25; color: rgb(36, 41, 46); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><a id="user-content-what-goes-into-a-review-1" class="anchor" href="https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/pull/636#what-goes-into-a-review-1" aria-hidden="true" style="box-sizing: border-box; background-color: transparent; -webkit-text-decoration-skip: objects; color: rgb(3, 102, 214); text-decoration: none; float: left; padding-right: 4px; margin-left: -20px; line-height: 1;"><svg aria-hidden="true" class="octicon octicon-link" height="16" version="1.1" viewBox="0 0 16 16" width="16"><path fill-rule="evenodd" d="M4 9h1v1H4c-1.5 0-3-1.69-3-3.5S2.55 3 4 3h4c1.45 0 3 1.69 3 3.5 0 1.41-.91 2.72-2 3.25V8.59c.58-.45 1-1.27 1-2.09C10 5.22 8.98 4 8 4H4c-.98 0-2 1.22-2 2.5S3 9 4 9zm9-3h-1v1h1c1 0 2 1.22 2 2.5S13.98 12 13 12H9c-.98 0-2-1.22-2-2.5 0-.83.42-1.64 1-2.09V6.25c-1.09.53-2 1.84-2 3.25C6 11.31 7.55 13 9 13h4c1.45 0 3-1.69 3-3.5S14.5 6 13 6z"></path></svg></a>What goes into a review?</h5><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(36, 41, 46); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">The goal of the review process is to improve the proposal under review through constructive criticism and, eventually, determine the direction of Swift. When writing your review, here are some questions you might want to answer in your review:</p><ul style="box-sizing: border-box; padding-left: 2em; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(36, 41, 46); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><li style="box-sizing: border-box;" class="">What is your evaluation of the proposal?</li><li style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0.25em;" class="">Is the problem being addressed significant enough to warrant a change to Swift?</li><li style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0.25em;" class="">Does this proposal fit well with the feel and direction of Swift?</li><li style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0.25em;" class="">If you have used other languages or libraries with a similar feature, how do you feel that this proposal compares to those?</li><li style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0.25em;" class="">How much effort did you put into your review? A glance, a quick reading, or an in-depth study?</li></ul><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(36, 41, 46); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">More information about the Swift evolution process is available at</p><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px 0px 16px; padding: 0px 1em; color: rgb(106, 115, 125); border-left-width: 0.25em; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(223, 226, 229); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><div style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class=""><a href="https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/process.md" style="box-sizing: border-box; background-color: transparent; -webkit-text-decoration-skip: objects; color: rgb(3, 102, 214); text-decoration: none;" class="">https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/process.md</a></div></blockquote><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(36, 41, 46); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">Thank you,</p><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(36, 41, 46); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">-Doug</p><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(36, 41, 46); font-family: -apple-system, BlinkMacSystemFont, 'Segoe UI', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">Review Manager</p></div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>swift-evolution-announce mailing list</span><br><span><a href="mailto:swift-evolution-announce@swift.org">swift-evolution-announce@swift.org</a></span><br><span><a href="https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution-announce">https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution-announce</a></span><br></div></blockquote></body></html>