<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Jul 1, 2016, at 8:57 AM, John McCall via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:</div><div class=""><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Jun 30, 2016, at 10:41 PM, Xiaodi Wu <<a href="mailto:xiaodi.wu@gmail.com" class="">xiaodi.wu@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><div class=""><div dir="ltr" class=""><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Jul 1, 2016 at 12:03 AM, Dave Abrahams via swift-evolution<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span dir="ltr" class=""><<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" target="_blank" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>></span><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>wrote:<br class=""><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"><span class=""><br class="">on Thu Jun 30 2016, John McCall <<a href="http://rjmccall-at-apple.com/" class="">rjmccall-AT-apple.com</a>> wrote:<br class=""><br class="">>> On Jun 30, 2016, at 6:12 PM, Dave Abrahams via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br class=""></span><div class=""><div class="h5">>> on Thu Jun 30 2016, Matthew Johnson <<a href="http://matthew-at-anandabits.com/" class="">matthew-AT-anandabits.com</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><<a href="http://matthew-at-anandabits.com/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" class="">http://matthew-at-anandabits.com/</a>>> wrote:<br class="">>><br class="">>>> Sent from my iPad<br class="">>>><br class="">><br class="">>>>> On Jun 30, 2016, at 6:59 PM, Erica Sadun via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br class="">>>>><br class="">>>>><br class="">>>>>>> On Jun 30, 2016, at 5:47 PM, James Berry <<a href="mailto:jberry@rogueorbit.com" class="">jberry@rogueorbit.com</a>> wrote:<br class="">>>>>>><br class="">>>>>>><br class="">>>>>>> On Jun 30, 2016, at 4:05 PM, Dave Abrahams via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br class="">>>>>>> on Thu Jun 30 2016, Erica Sadun <<a href="http://erica-at-ericasadun.com/" class="">erica-AT-ericasadun.com</a>> wrote:<br class="">>>>>>><br class="">>>>>>>>> On Jun 30, 2016, at 4:41 PM, Dave Abrahams <<a href="mailto:dabrahams@apple.com" class="">dabrahams@apple.com</a>> wrote:<br class="">>>>>>>>>> I mentioned this in a comment on the gist already, but I'm really not<br class="">>>>>>>>>> digging the "array" in `arraySpacing`. We've already moved from top-level<br class="">>>>>>>>>> "stride" to "memory layout spacing," gaining plenty of clarity. I'm<br class="">>>>>>>>>> skeptical that the "array" adds anything more. Moreover, it muddies the<br class="">>>>>>>>>> waters by mentioning a specific type (Array) in a context where you're<br class="">>>>>>>>>> querying the memory layout properties of another type.<br class="">>>>>>>>><br class="">>>>>>>>> OK, I agree with that. If we have “alignment” rather than<br class="">>>>>>>>> “defaultAlignment,” I suppose we can have plain “spacing.”<br class="">>>>>>>><br class="">>>>>>>> No way to last-second sell you on interval rather than spacing?<br class="">>>>>>><br class="">>>>>>> If you can explain why it's better.<br class="">>>>>>><br class="">>>>>>>> // Returns the least possible interval between distinct instances of<br class="">>>>>>>> /// `T` in memory. The result is always positive.<br class="">>>>>>><br class="">>>>>>> For me, “interval” doesn't go with “size” and “alignment,” which are all<br class="">>>>>>> about physical distances and locations. There are all kinds of<br class="">>>>>>> “intervals,” e.g. time intervals.<br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>> Hmm. Sounds like stride to me. stride or byteStride?<br class="">>>>>><br class="">>>>>> James<br class="">>>>><br class="">>>>> FAQ: "Why aren't you using the obvious phrase `stride` for something that clearly<br class="">>>>> returns the memory stride?"<br class="">>>>><br class="">>>>> ANSWER: "As stride already has a well-established meaning in the standard library,<br class="">>>>> this proposal changes the name to spacing, providing a simple but correct name that<br class="">>>>> works well enough in its intended use. Measuring memory is sufficiently esoteric<br class="">>>>> that we prefer to reserve `stride` for a more common use case."<br class="">>>><br class="">>>> Counter: some words have more than one well established meaning when<br class="">>>> used in different contexts. 'spacing' isn't too bad here (much better<br class="">>>> than 'arraySpacing') but sticking to the term of art 'stride' would be<br class="">>>> best IMO. As James mentioned, spacing implies empty space *between*<br class="">>>> items whereas stride matches the meaning of this property *exactly*<br class="">>>> (which is why it is the term of art).<br class="">>>><br class="">>>> If a programmer can't distinguish between a 'stride' property on<br class="">>>> MemoryLayout and the 'stride' function they probably have no business<br class="">>>> doing anything which requires use of MemoryLayout in the first place.<br class="">>><br class="">>> I don't believe that “stride” *is* the accepted term of art for this<br class="">>> meaning. I never heard of the idea of types having an intrinsic<br class="">>> “stride” until I arrived on the Swift project. That usage came from<br class="">>> “strideof.”<br class="">>><br class="">>> If you all swear up and down that you've been talking about “the stride<br class="">>> of a type” for more than 2 years, I won't fight you on this.<br class="">>> Otherwise... well, I still won't fight; I'm being crushed by an<br class="">>> avalanche of bikesheds and I can't muster the energy ;->... but I'll<br class="">>> forever be plagued by doubts about the name.<br class="">><br class="">> As the person who originally picked "stride" here, I agree that I've never<br class="">> heard of people talking about the "stride" of a type; people talk about striding<br class="">> over an array, and they talk about the size of one's stride, and that size<br class="">> can be measured in bytes. That's all I was thinking.<br class="">><br class="">> However, I was just picking a name for an internal implementation concept;<br class="">> I did not expect it to be used in the standard library.<br class="">><br class="">> I don't really like "spacing"; it sounds too much like a synonym for "padding",<br class="">> i.e. the amount of empty space between elements rather than the total amount<br class="">> of space for each element. But I don't mean to re-open wounds; if people<br class="">> have settled on "spacing", have at it.<br class=""><br class=""></div></div>Better names are always welcome if you can come up with one.<br class=""></blockquote><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">FWIW, courtesy of the thesaurus, curated to eliminate clearly unsuitable words:<br class=""><div class="">breadth, dimension, expanse, interval, period, space, span, stretch, width</div></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Of these, span might be the most OK.</div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div class=""><br class=""></div></div><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">Another thought is "arrayElementSize", or "sizeAsArrayElement", or "sizeInArray". Somewhat verbose, though.</span></div></blockquote><br class=""></div><div>Ignore me; I should stop responding to things sent to my inbox before I read the rest of the thread. 'stride' sounds good to me.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>John.</div><br class=""></body></html>