<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Jun 30, 2016 at 2:09 PM, Matthew Johnson <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:matthew@anandabits.com" target="_blank">matthew@anandabits.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word"><br><div><span class=""><blockquote type="cite"><div>On Jun 30, 2016, at 1:48 PM, Xiaodi Wu <<a href="mailto:xiaodi.wu@gmail.com" target="_blank">xiaodi.wu@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br><div>As Anton mentioned earlier, I feel the same way with respect to naming. No need to reiterate the points already made, but I do want to chime in on the topic of rarely used syntax.<br><br>While I agree of course that a cumbersome syntax for a rarely used feature is _not as bad_ as a cumbersome syntax for a common feature, all other things being equal, I think we should press for the most elegant possible syntax for all aspects of the language. It is needless, IMO, to insist that less commonly used features *ought* to be weighed down with more cumbersome spelling.<br></div></blockquote><div><br></div></span><div>I agree. I’m not arguing against elegant syntax here. In fact the opposite - my preference is for the syntax I consider to be the most elegant (above and below in this case). I’m just not willing to argue to strenuously over a less commonly used feature when the alternatives are reasonable, if slightly less elegant.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Sorry--I wasn't directing the comment to you or trying to imply that you were arguing for less elegant syntax. Overall, I think everyone who's commented so far is in violent agreement that a more elegant syntax exists and has been suggested in some form or other.</div><div><br></div><div>The comment was more a general point that "we all agree it can be better, but this is so rare, so maybe let's just call it a day" feels a little off, and that perhaps it'd be worth exploring a line of argument more like "we all agree it can be better, so barring any reason why a more commonly used feature would prohibit them, let's see if we can move closer to the better options."</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><span style="color:rgb(80,0,80)">On Thu, Jun 30, 2016 at 13:25 Matthew Johnson via swift-evolution <</span><a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" target="_blank">swift-evolution@swift.org</a><span style="color:rgb(80,0,80)">> wrote:</span></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div style="word-wrap:break-word"><div><div><div class="h5"><blockquote type="cite"><div><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><br>
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Sent from my iPad<br>
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On Jun 30, 2016, at 1:08 PM, John McCall via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" target="_blank">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
>> On Jun 30, 2016, at 2:34 AM, Anton Zhilin via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" target="_blank">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br>
>> <a href="https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/proposals" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/proposals</a><br>
>> /<a href="http://0077-operator-precedence.md/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">0077-operator-precedence.md</a><br>
>><br>
>> Idea #1<br>
>><br>
>> There is a high chance that 'higherThan'/'lowerThan' names will be<br>
>> chosen. I still see a problem with that. Keywords in Swift are written<br>
>> in full lowercase, so we should actually take 'higherthan'/'lowerthan'.<br>
>><br>
>> But then what's the point of the preposition? It blends with<br>
>> higher/lower and doesn't actually add any clarity. So we should drop<br>
>> 'than' and have just higher/lower or above/below or succeeds/preceeds or<br>
>> whatever we choose, but *in a single word*.<br>
><br>
> The preposition does add clarity. Are the listed precedences the ones that are<br>
> higher than the current precedence, or are they the ones that the current<br>
> precedence is higher than?<br>
<br>
I agree with that for higher and lower, but I think above and below are pretty clear (in the example just below it seems very clear (to me at least) that Multiplicative is above additive and below Exponentiative).<br>
<br>
I think above and below are aesthetically the best here, but as has been noted this will be a rarely used feature so I won't feel bad if something else is selected,<br>
<br>
<br>
><br>
> John.<br>
><br>
>><br>
>> Idea #2<br>
>><br>
>> I personally don't like the direction in which the proposal moved (I<br>
>> understand the reasons). Before the first review, consensus seemed to be<br>
>> on this:<br>
>><br>
>> precedence Multiplicative {<br>
>> above Additive<br>
>> below Exponentiative<br>
>> }<br>
>><br>
>> And now:<br>
>><br>
>> precedencegroup MultiplicativePrecedence {<br>
>> higherThan: AdditivePrecedence<br>
>> lowerThan: ExponentiativePrecedence<br>
>> }<br>
>><br>
>> Don't you have a feeling that something cute and 'swift' was turned into<br>
>> a monster?<br>
>><br>
>> At least, if we change keywords, we will get this:<br>
>><br>
>> precedence MultiplicativePrecedence {<br>
>> above: AdditivePrecedence<br>
>> below: ExponentiativePrecedence<br>
>> }<br>
>><br>
>> I also like in above/below that they are written with the same number of<br>
>> letters, meaning that they will line up nicely.<br>
>><br>
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