<html><head><style>
body {
font-family: "Helvetica Neue", Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif;
padding:1em;
margin:auto;
background:#fefefe;
}
h1, h2, h3, h4, h5, h6 {
font-weight: bold;
}
h1 {
color: #000000;
font-size: 28pt;
}
h2 {
border-bottom: 1px solid #CCCCCC;
color: #000000;
font-size: 24px;
}
h3 {
font-size: 18px;
}
h4 {
font-size: 16px;
}
h5 {
font-size: 14px;
}
h6 {
color: #777777;
background-color: inherit;
font-size: 14px;
}
hr {
height: 0.2em;
border: 0;
color: #CCCCCC;
background-color: #CCCCCC;
display: inherit;
}
p, blockquote, ul, ol, dl, li, table, pre {
margin: 15px 0;
}
a, a:visited {
color: #4183C4;
background-color: inherit;
text-decoration: none;
}
#message {
border-radius: 6px;
border: 1px solid #ccc;
display:block;
width:100%;
height:60px;
margin:6px 0px;
}
button, #ws {
font-size: 12 pt;
padding: 4px 6px;
border-radius: 5px;
border: 1px solid #bbb;
background-color: #eee;
}
code, pre, #ws, #message {
font-family: Monaco;
font-size: 10pt;
border-radius: 3px;
background-color: #F8F8F8;
color: inherit;
}
code {
border: 1px solid #EAEAEA;
margin: 0 2px;
padding: 0 5px;
}
pre {
border: 1px solid #CCCCCC;
overflow: auto;
padding: 4px 8px;
}
pre > code {
border: 0;
margin: 0;
padding: 0;
}
#ws { background-color: #f8f8f8; }
.bloop_markdown table {
border-collapse: collapse;
font-family: Helvetica, arial, freesans, clean, sans-serif;
color: rgb(51, 51, 51);
font-size: 15px; line-height: 25px;
padding: 0; }
.bloop_markdown table tr {
border-top: 1px solid #cccccc;
background-color: white;
margin: 0;
padding: 0; }
.bloop_markdown table tr:nth-child(2n) {
background-color: #f8f8f8; }
.bloop_markdown table tr th {
font-weight: bold;
border: 1px solid #cccccc;
margin: 0;
padding: 6px 13px; }
.bloop_markdown table tr td {
border: 1px solid #cccccc;
margin: 0;
padding: 6px 13px; }
.bloop_markdown table tr th :first-child, table tr td :first-child {
margin-top: 0; }
.bloop_markdown table tr th :last-child, table tr td :last-child {
margin-bottom: 0; }
.bloop_markdown blockquote{
border-left: 4px solid #dddddd;
padding: 0 15px;
color: #777777; }
blockquote > :first-child {
margin-top: 0; }
blockquote > :last-child {
margin-bottom: 0; }
code, pre, #ws, #message {
word-break: normal;
word-wrap: normal;
}
hr {
display: inherit;
}
.bloop_markdown :first-child {
-webkit-margin-before: 0;
}
code, pre, #ws, #message {
font-family: Menlo, Consolas, Liberation Mono, Courier, monospace;
}
.send { color:#77bb77; }
.server { color:#7799bb; }
.error { color:#AA0000; }</style></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;"><div class="bloop_markdown"><p>This also depends on the keyboard layout you have. I mean looking at the English keyboard layout the <code>\</code> character is presented and easily accessible with just a single tap.</p>
<p>For me it’s always been a problem, this is not a strong argument for changing that behavior but it would ease at least my workflow.</p>
<p><code>Shift + CMD + 7</code> == <code>\</code> for my German keyboard layout.</p>
<p></p></div><div class="bloop_original_html"><style>body{font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px}</style><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div> <br> <div id="bloop_sign_1466612567241588992" class="bloop_sign"><div style="font-family:helvetica,arial;font-size:13px">-- <br>Adrian Zubarev<br>Sent with Airmail</div></div> <br><p class="airmail_on">Am 22. Juni 2016 um 18:21:10, Jeremy Pereira via swift-evolution (<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>) schrieb:</p> <blockquote type="cite" class="clean_bq"><span><div><div></div><div><br>> On 22 Jun 2016, at 17:02, Brandon Knope <bknope@me.com> wrote:<br>> <br>> No it shows where your hand frequently is also<br><br>And you don’t think there is a correlation between where the frequently pressed keys are and where your hands are? If you were needing to press the \ key a lot, there would be a hotspot over it. Then you could say “look, I need to press this key a lot and it’s miles away from the other hotspot”. <br><br>> <br>> Brandon<br>> <br>>> On Jun 22, 2016, at 12:01 PM, Jeremy Pereira <jeremy.j.pereira@googlemail.com> wrote:<br>>> <br>>> <br>>>> On 22 Jun 2016, at 16:41, Brandon Knope <bknope@me.com> wrote:<br>>>> <br>>>> My point was not to argue for the removal of \. My point was that there is a measurable way to test the usability of such a key<br>>> <br>>> <br>>> Your heat map doesn’t test the usability of a key, it tests the frequency with which it was pressed. The fact that there was no coloured blob on the backslash key just means you don’t use it very often.<br>>> <br>>> <br>>>> <br>>>> Brandon<br>>>> <br>>>>> On Jun 22, 2016, at 11:30 AM, Jeremy Pereira <jeremy.j.pereira@googlemail.com> wrote:<br>>>>> <br>>>>> I find it somewhat disturbing that we are now trying to base language design around the layout of a US English keyboard.<br>>>>> <br>>>>> “\” on my keyboard (British Macbook Pro Retina) is right next to the return key. It’s also much closer to the parentheses characters than $ is and (if you assume we are going to replace parentheses with braces as was suggested upthread) right next to the brace keys. <br>>>>> <br>>>>> Anyway, your heat map evidence actually negates the argument. If it was a frequently used key, it would have a hot spot of its own. It’s not (I tried it on some random samples of my own code), so that implies it is not a key that is used very often, which further implies it *should* be a little out of the way.<br>>>>> <br>>>>> *The* escape character for strings is “\”. Please let’s not introduce a second one.<br>>>>> <br>>>>> <br>>>>>> On 22 Jun 2016, at 00:08, Brandon Knope via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> wrote:<br>>>>>> <br>>>>>> Actually… we can go pretty scientific on this sort of thing and heat map keyboard usage to get a better picture of how “usable” this is.<br>>>>>> <br>>>>>> I pasted a file that contains seven \’s in it and heat mapped it at https://www.patrick-wied.at/projects/heatmap-keyboard/<br>>>>>> <br>>>>>> Even *with* several \’s throughout my source file the majority of my key presses take place much closer to the $ key than the \ key.<br>>>>>> <br>>>>>> I think we can all argue about what is clearer or not, but I think for the majority of us, the \ key is quite inconvenient compared to the keys around where we type the most.<br>>>>>> <br>>>>>> I also ran several of iOS 10’s sample code through the heat map and continue to get pretty similar results: the \ is much further from the hottest part of the keyboard than the ones closer to where your hand usually rests.<br>>>>>> <br>>>>>> Maybe this is flawed, but I think it is hard to argue that the \ is easy to type when there are far more usable alternatives.<br>>>>>> <br>>>>>> Brandon<br>>>>>> <br>>>>>> <br>>>>>> <br>>>>>>> On Jun 21, 2016, at 6:10 PM, Daniel Resnick via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> wrote:<br>>>>>>> <br>>>>>>> I also disagree for the same reasons that Gwynne and Brent mentioned: I find '\(...)' easy to read, fine to type, and consistent with other string escaping syntax.<br>>>>>>> <br>>>>>>> On Tue, Jun 21, 2016 at 3:55 PM, Brent Royal-Gordon via swift-evolution <swift-evolution@swift.org> wrote:<br>>>>>>>> I find that typing \(var) is very disruptive to my typing flow. The more I code in Swift, the more I like it, but every time I'm coding and then have to hiccup while typing \ then ( causes me to be annoyed. I know, it's minor, but it isn't a key combination that flows quickly.<br>>>>>>>> <br>>>>>>>> I would much rather have $() or perhaps ${} (like Groovy lang) or perhaps @() to go along with other uses of @ throughout the language.<br>>>>>>> <br>>>>>>> Even though I'm used to Perl's and Ruby's interpolation syntaxes, I immediately liked `\(…)`. It's parsimonious: Rather than taking a third character (besides \ and ") to mean something special in a string literal, it reuses one of the existing ones. There's no need to escape a character you wouldn't otherwise have to touch, or to think of another character as "magical" in a string. It fits nicely with the rest of the syntax, with `\` indicating a special construct and then `()` delimiting an expression, just as they do elsewhere in the language. It's an elegant solution to a problem traditionally solved inelegantly. It's very Swifty in that way.<br>>>>>>> <br>>>>>>>> A shifted key, like $ or @, followed by another shifted key like (, allows for a much faster flow and they are much closer to the home keys than \ which is nearly as far from home keys as possible (and awkward).<br>>>>>>> <br>>>>>>> <br>>>>>>> I don't have any trouble typing it personally. If you find yourself accidentally typing `\9` or `|(`, we could probably offer an error for the former or warning for the latter with a fix-it. But if you're complaining that it takes a tiny fraction of a second longer to type than `$(` would, then honestly, I just can't bring myself to care. Swift optimizes for code reading. If we wanted to optimize for code typing instead, we'd have a very different style.<br>>>>>>> <br>>>>>>> --<br>>>>>>> Brent Royal-Gordon<br>>>>>>> Architechies<br>>>>>>> <br>>>>>>> _______________________________________________<br>>>>>>> swift-evolution mailing list<br>>>>>>> swift-evolution@swift.org<br>>>>>>> https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution<br>>>>>>> <br>>>>>>> _______________________________________________<br>>>>>>> swift-evolution mailing list<br>>>>>>> swift-evolution@swift.org<br>>>>>>> https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution<br>>>>>> <br>>>>>> _______________________________________________<br>>>>>> swift-evolution mailing list<br>>>>>> swift-evolution@swift.org<br>>>>>> https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution<br>>>>> <br>>>> <br>>> <br>> <br><br>_______________________________________________<br>swift-evolution mailing list<br>swift-evolution@swift.org<br>https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution<br></div></div></span></blockquote></div><div class="bloop_markdown"><p></p></div></body></html>