<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class="">Sorry for my absence.<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><div class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class="">Increment/decrement operators, currying, tuple splat and even the C-style for loop have already been deprecated, and although I would have preferred to keep some of those constructs, I think it is good how progressive Swift is pushed forward ("would we add this feature now if it wasn't already there?”)</blockquote><div><br class=""></div>That is exactly my opinion.</div></div></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Thanks Haravikk for compiling a list with pros/cons.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><div>In my opinion, we have a perfectly fine way to express “a sequence of values”. And that is arrays. So why would you need a second concept to accomplish the exact same thing? In fact, inside the implementing function all varargs *are* arrays, why aren’t they outside?</div><div><br class=""></div><div>The other reason I don’t like them is that, at the call site, you cannot distinguish between them and C functions (or badly named Swift functions).</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Take the C stdlib atan2 function for example:</div><div><br class=""></div><div><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: rgb(187, 44, 162);" class="">let</span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures;" class=""> a = </span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: rgb(61, 29, 129);" class="">atan2</span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures;" class="">(</span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: rgb(39, 42, 216);" class="">3.0</span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures;" class="">, </span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: rgb(39, 42, 216);" class="">4.0</span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures;" class="">)</span> </div><div><br class=""></div><div>Does it take 2 Doubles? Or does it take a vararg list of Doubles. Can I do <span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: rgb(187, 44, 162);" class="">let</span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures;" class=""> a = </span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: rgb(61, 29, 129);" class="">atan2</span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures;" class="">(</span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: rgb(39, 42, 216);" class="">3.0</span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures;" class="">, </span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: rgb(39, 42, 216);" class="">4.0</span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures;" class="">, </span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: rgb(39, 42, 216);" class="">5.0</span><span style="font-family: Menlo; font-size: 11px; font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures;" class="">)</span>? I cannot tell by reading someone else’s code (and there is quite a lot of C code out there).</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Even in Swift it is possible to write functions like these:</div><div><br class=""></div><div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo;" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #bb2ca2" class="">func</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class=""> whichOne(t: </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #703daa" class="">Int</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">) -> </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #703daa" class="">Int</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class=""> {</span></div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo; color: rgb(187, 44, 162);" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #000000" class=""> </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">return</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #000000" class=""> </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #272ad8" class="">1</span></div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo;" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">}</span></div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo; min-height: 13px;" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class=""></span><br class=""></div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo;" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #bb2ca2" class="">func</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class=""> whichOne(t: </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #703daa" class="">Int</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">...) -> </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #703daa" class="">Int</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class=""> {</span></div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo; color: rgb(187, 44, 162);" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #000000" class=""> </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">return</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #000000" class=""> </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #272ad8" class="">2</span></div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo;" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">}</span></div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo; min-height: 13px;" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class=""></span><br class=""></div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo;" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #bb2ca2" class="">func</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class=""> whichOne(t: </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #703daa" class="">Int</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">, </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #bb2ca2" class="">_</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class=""> t2: </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #703daa" class="">Int</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">...) -> </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #703daa" class="">Int</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class=""> {</span></div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo; color: rgb(187, 44, 162);" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #000000" class=""> </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">return</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #000000" class=""> </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #272ad8" class="">3</span></div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo;" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">}</span></div></div><div><br class=""></div><div>Now call these functions:</div><div><br class=""></div><div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo;" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #31595d" class="">whichOne</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">(</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #272ad8" class="">1</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">)</span></div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo;" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #31595d" class="">whichOne</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">(</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #272ad8" class="">2</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">, </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #272ad8" class="">2</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">)</span></div><div style="margin: 0px; font-size: 11px; line-height: normal; font-family: Menlo;" class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #31595d" class="">whichOne</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">(</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #272ad8" class="">3</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">, </span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures; color: #272ad8" class="">3</span><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class="">)</span></div><div class=""><span style="font-variant-ligatures: no-common-ligatures" class=""><br class=""></span></div></div><div>Can you guess what they return? (answer: 1,3,3)</div><div><br class=""></div><div>In the end it’s just another concept to learn (or at least to be aware of) which in and of itself does not create much of an added value (except you save two characters []).</div></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">- Dennis</div><div class="">
<br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Apr 20, 2016, at 4:56 PM, Tino Heth via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class="">The question is whether the downside to variadic parameters is really enough to justify _removing_ an existing language feature. <br class=""><br class="">The burden of justification should be on those people wanting to change the language, not on those wanting to maintain the status quo and “I don’t like it” or “I think it makes code a tiny bit less readable” is not sufficient justification, in my opinion because you already have the option not to use the feature. <br class=""></blockquote>Afaics, this isn't true:<br class=""></div></div></blockquote></div><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div class="">The value of variadic functions is imho less than the possibility to omit "()" in procedure calls, and afair, there have been several posts that illustrate the complications of this feature.<br class="">_______________________________________________<br class="">swift-evolution mailing list<br class=""><a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a><br class="">https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution<br class=""></div></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></div></body></html>