<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Mar 28, 2016, at 7:34 PM, Erica Sadun <<a href="mailto:erica@ericasadun.com" class="">erica@ericasadun.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">On Mar 28, 2016, at 6:19 PM, Dave via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class="">On Mar 25, 2016, at 4:45 PM, Dave Abrahams <<a href="mailto:dabrahams@apple.com" class="">dabrahams@apple.com</a>> wrote:<br class=""><br class="">on Fri Mar 25 2016,<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://davesweeris-at-mac.com/" class="">davesweeris-AT-mac.com</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>wrote:<br class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class="">Can we rename `subtract` to `complement`, since that’s the correct<br class="">term? At least, I’m assuming that’s what `subtract` means… if not, I’m<br class="">confused.<br class=""><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Set_(mathematics)#Complements" class="">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Set_(mathematics)#Complements</a><br class=""></blockquote><br class="">It's not just “complement,” because that means inverting set membership<br class="">of everything in a finite domain. It would have to be “relative<br class="">complement.” But “relative complement” lacks the directional<br class="">implication that plagues terms like “difference,” but not “subtracting.”<br class=""></blockquote><br class="">Fair points… I accidentally left off the argument label. May I amend my suggestion to "rename `subtract(:)` to `complement(relativeTo:)`”? It just seems to me that if we’re going to claim we’re implementing something, we should adopt as much of its “standard" syntax and terminology as possible. It makes Swift easier to use for those coming from other disciplines, IMHO.<br class=""></div></div></blockquote></div><br class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">If you took 100 random developers off the street, and showed them code that said:</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><font face="Menlo" class="">set1.formRelativeComplement(set2)</font></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">and</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><font face="Menlo" class="">set1.subtracting(set2)</font></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">About 99.5% of them would understand the second better than the first on first read. </div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">The other 0.5 of a developer would be living somewhere near Boulder and growing </div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">his own hemi-pharmaceuticals.</div></div></blockquote><div>With my amended suggestion, that would read "<font face="Menlo" class="">set1.formComplement(relativeTo: set2)</font>”. Either way, though, if you’re claiming that “complement(relativeTo:)” or “complementRelativeTo(:)” shouldn’t be used because it’s too unrecognizable compared to the roughly-analogous term “subtract", then surely “union”, intersection”, and especially “symmetricDifference” all fail that test as well when compared to some very well-known terms:</div><div><font face="Menlo" class="">set1.or(set2) //union</font></div><div><font face="Menlo" class="">set1.and(set2) //intersection</font></div><div><span style="font-family: Menlo;" class="">set1.xor(set2) </span><span style="font-family: Menlo;" class="">//symmetric difference</span></div><div>(Plus, they work & play well with non-unicode operators.)</div><div><br class=""></div><div>My issue isn’t so much that the proposal doesn’t implement the “correct” mathematical notation, it’s that it uses a very formal-sounding name ("Set Algebra”), and very nearly implements the basic operations of Set Theory (which sounds very similar to “Set Algebra”), but then falls short by renaming just one operation. Although, come to think of it, the proposal is missing `cartesianProduct` as well… Oh well, at least it’s not in there under a different name. :-)</div><div><br class=""></div><div><br class=""></div><div><br class=""></div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">The problem with subtraction is that there isn't really a good<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><font face="Menlo" class="">noun/formNoun</font><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>pair</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">for it. </div></div></blockquote>...<br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">In all my attempts at trying to brainstorm up a better word that would (1) retain</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">the characteristics of mutating/non-mutating pairing while (2) being easy to read</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">and understand, I could not come up with better than Dave A's<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><font face="Menlo" class="">subtract/subtracting</font>.</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">I may not like it aesthetically but when it comes to offering something better,</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">I've got nothing.</div></div></blockquote><div>I think these two statements have the same root cause: Pretty much everyone has heard of subtraction, but the closest most people come to formally thinking about sets is trying to decide who to pick for their fantasy football team. The concept of operating on sets simply isn’t widespread enough for english to have a colloquial word which conveys the required meaning. “Subtract” does come close, but the AFAIK two concepts are only analogous in that subtraction is often first taught from the POV of “imagine a set of x elements, take away y of them, and count how many are left over” (see the first graphic in <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subtraction" class="">https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subtraction</a>, if that doesn’t ring a bell). The analogy doesn’t really work if your sets are, well, sets, as opposed to visual representations of numbers. The only other “widely-recognized” term that I can think of is “minus” (which I’d prefer over “subtract” because it seems less precisely defined to me). Neither one is a noun, though, so they both break the noun/formNoun pattern.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Speaking of nouns...</div><div><div class=""></div></div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div><div class="">That means either breaking the pair into two words that aren't well matched</div><div class="">or using a noun that isn't that amazing, such as <font face="Menlo" class="">difference</font>.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><font face="Menlo" class="">set1.difference(set2)</font></div><div class=""><font face="Menlo" class="">set1.formDifference(set2)</font></div></div></blockquote><div>You can gain the requisite “directional implication” Dave Abrahams was talking about by adding some labels:</div><div><font face="Menlo" class="">set1.difference(from: set2)</font></div><div><font face="Menlo" class="">set1.formDifference(from: set2)</font></div><div><br class=""></div><div><br class=""></div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">That said, I'd really like to see a Swift Doc markup that allows you to mark</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">pairs of mutating/nonmutating functions, not from a compiler point of</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">view but in doc markup.</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><font face="Menlo" class="">/// - nonmutatingVersion: </font></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><font face="Menlo" class="">/// - mutatingVersion:</font></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">What group handles expansion of the markup keywords and how can I file a</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">feature request asking for this to be added?</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">Thanks,</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">-- E</div></div></blockquote></div>+1 :-)</body></html>