<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div></div><div><br></div><div>Am 19.02.2016 um 19:39 schrieb Joe Groff <<a href="mailto:jgroff@apple.com">jgroff@apple.com</a>>:<br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=us-ascii"><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Feb 19, 2016, at 7:39 AM, Thorsten Seitz <<a href="mailto:tseitz42@icloud.com" class="">tseitz42@icloud.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8" class=""><div dir="auto" class=""><div class=""></div><div class="">I'm having trouble wrapping my head around the difference between accessors and methods defined by a property: AFAIU accessors are like abstract methods if required and just like methods if not, whereas methods are like final methods as they cannot be overridden in a property use site.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div><div>Accessors are provided by the var declaration using the behavior. Methods are fixed implementations.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Thanks! So accessors are indeed like abstract methods (if required) and methods are like final methods.<div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div dir="auto" class=""><div class="">If I did understand this correctly then I'd prefer that instead of "accessor" we would just use "func" and introduce a new keyword "abstract". The latter can then be extended to classes in another proposal.</div></div></div></blockquote></div></blockquote><div><br></div>i.e. instead of a required "accessor" we would use "abstract func" and instead of an "accessor" with a default implementation we would use "func".</div><div>Instead of "func" for methods we would use "final func".</div><div><br></div><div>Then the only new concept would be "abstract" instead of "accessor" and we could extend it to normal methods which would be welcome.</div><div><br></div><div>-Thorsten </div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div> </div><div><blockquote type="cite"><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div dir="auto" class=""><div class=""><br class="">Am 19.02.2016 um 03:56 schrieb Joe Groff via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>>:<br class=""><br class=""></div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=us-ascii" class="">Based on review feedback, I've revised the declaration syntax proposal for property behaviors to be more in line with our other declaration forms, reverting to the earlier pre-review "var behavior" proposal. I've updated the proposal in swift-evolution:<div class=""><br class=""></div><blockquote style="margin: 0 0 0 40px; border: none; padding: 0px;" class=""><div class=""><a href="https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/proposals/0030-property-behavior-decls.md" class="">https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/proposals/0030-property-behavior-decls.md</a></div><div class=""><br class=""></div></blockquote>In discussion with the core team, we've also strongly come in favor of applying behaviors to properties using attribute syntax, e.g.:<div class=""><br class=""></div><blockquote style="margin: 0 0 0 40px; border: none; padding: 0px;" class=""><div class="">@lazy var x = 111</div><div class="">@delayed var x: Int</div><div class=""><br class=""></div></blockquote>They're definitely attribute-like, and we think it makes sense for behaviors to be the first of hopefully many kinds of user-defined behaviors. What do you all think of this direction?<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">-Joe<br class=""><div class=""><div class=""><div class=""><br class=""><div class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Feb 10, 2016, at 2:00 PM, Douglas Gregor via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=us-ascii" class=""><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">Hello Swift community,</p><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">The review of SE-0030 "Property Behaviors" begins now and runs through February, 2016. The proposal is available here:</p><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px 0px 16px; padding: 0px 15px; color: rgb(119, 119, 119); border-left-width: 4px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(221, 221, 221); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><div style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class=""><a href="https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/proposals/NNNN-proposal.md" style="box-sizing: border-box; background-color: transparent; color: rgb(64, 120, 192); text-decoration: none;" class="">https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/proposals/0030-property-behavior-decls.md</a></div></blockquote><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">Reviews are an important part of the Swift evolution process. All reviews should be sent to the swift-evolution mailing list at</p><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px 0px 16px; padding: 0px 15px; color: rgb(119, 119, 119); border-left-width: 4px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(221, 221, 221); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><div style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class=""><a href="https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution" style="box-sizing: border-box; background-color: transparent; color: rgb(64, 120, 192); text-decoration: none;" class="">https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution</a></div></blockquote><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">or, if you would like to keep your feedback private, directly to the review manager. When replying, please try to keep the proposal link at the top of the message:</p><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px 0px 16px; padding: 0px 15px; color: rgb(119, 119, 119); border-left-width: 4px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(221, 221, 221); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px;" class="">Proposal link:</p><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px 0px 16px; padding: 0px 15px; border-left-width: 4px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(221, 221, 221);" class=""><div style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class=""><a href="https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/proposals/0030-property-behavior-decls.md" class="">https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/proposals/0030-property-behavior-decls.md</a></div></blockquote><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px;" class="">Reply text</p><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px; padding: 0px 15px; border-left-width: 4px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(221, 221, 221);" class=""><div style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class="">Other replies</div></blockquote></blockquote><h5 style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 1em; margin-bottom: 16px; line-height: 1.4; font-size: 1em; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><a id="user-content-what-goes-into-a-review-1" class="anchor" href="https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution#what-goes-into-a-review-1" aria-hidden="true" style="box-sizing: border-box; background-color: transparent; color: rgb(64, 120, 192); text-decoration: none; display: inline-block; padding-right: 2px; margin-left: -18px; line-height: 1.1;"><svg aria-hidden="true" class="octicon octicon-link" height="16" role="img" version="1.1" viewBox="0 0 16 16" width="16"><path d="M4 9h1v1h-1c-1.5 0-3-1.69-3-3.5s1.55-3.5 3-3.5h4c1.45 0 3 1.69 3 3.5 0 1.41-0.91 2.72-2 3.25v-1.16c0.58-0.45 1-1.27 1-2.09 0-1.28-1.02-2.5-2-2.5H4c-0.98 0-2 1.22-2 2.5s1 2.5 2 2.5z m9-3h-1v1h1c1 0 2 1.22 2 2.5s-1.02 2.5-2 2.5H9c-0.98 0-2-1.22-2-2.5 0-0.83 0.42-1.64 1-2.09v-1.16c-1.09 0.53-2 1.84-2 3.25 0 1.81 1.55 3.5 3 3.5h4c1.45 0 3-1.69 3-3.5s-1.5-3.5-3-3.5z"></path></svg></a>What goes into a review?</h5><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">The goal of the review process is to improve the proposal under review through constructive criticism and, eventually, determine the direction of Swift. When writing your review, here are some questions you might want to answer in your review:</p><ul style="box-sizing: border-box; padding: 0px 0px 0px 2em; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><li style="box-sizing: border-box;" class="">What is your evaluation of the proposal?</li><li style="box-sizing: border-box;" class="">Is the problem being addressed significant enough to warrant a change to Swift?</li><li style="box-sizing: border-box;" class="">Does this proposal fit well with the feel and direction of Swift?</li><li style="box-sizing: border-box;" class="">If you have used other languages or libraries with a similar feature, how do you feel that this proposal compares to those?</li><li style="box-sizing: border-box;" class="">How much effort did you put into your review? A glance, a quick reading, or an in-depth study?</li></ul><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">More information about the Swift evolution process is available at</p><blockquote style="box-sizing: border-box; margin: 0px 0px 16px; padding: 0px 15px; color: rgb(119, 119, 119); border-left-width: 4px; border-left-style: solid; border-left-color: rgb(221, 221, 221); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=""><div style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px;" class=""><a href="https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/process.md" style="box-sizing: border-box; background-color: transparent; color: rgb(64, 120, 192); text-decoration: none;" class="">https://github.com/apple/swift-evolution/blob/master/process.md</a></div></blockquote><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">Thank you,</p><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">Doug Gregor</p><p style="box-sizing: border-box; margin-top: 0px; margin-bottom: 16px; color: rgb(51, 51, 51); font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, 'Segoe UI', Arial, freesans, sans-serif, 'Apple Color Emoji', 'Segoe UI Emoji', 'Segoe UI Symbol'; font-size: 16px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" class="">Review Manager</p></div>_______________________________________________<br class="">swift-evolution mailing list<br class=""><a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a><br class=""><a href="https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution" class="">https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution</a><br class=""></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><span class="">_______________________________________________</span><br class=""><span class="">swift-evolution mailing list</span><br class=""><span class=""><a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a></span><br class=""><span class=""><a href="https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution" class="">https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution</a></span><br class=""></div></blockquote></div></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></blockquote></div></body></html>