<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>I think that the simple rule that all parameters, wether in init or a method have named parameters. I.E. I like:</div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div><div id="AppleMailSignature"> <span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">say(message: “hello”)</span></div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div><div id="AppleMailSignature">Since to me it is clear. </div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div><div id="AppleMailSignature">I also note there is considerable discussion in the API guidelines about how to qualify method names particularly when type is vey general like Any, e.g. append:</div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div><div id="AppleMailSignature"> anyArray.append([1, 2, 3])<br><br>Does this append the single element [1, 2, 3] (an array) or does it append three separate elements, 1, 2, and 3? If the argument is labeled then it is clear:</div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);"> anyArray.append(element: [1, 2, 3]) // append with a single argument</span></div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><span style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);"> anyArray.append(elements: 1, 2, 3) // append with var arts</span></div><div id="AppleMailSignature"><br>Sent from my iPad</div><div><br>On 25 Jan 2016, at 12:46 PM, Charles Srstka via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"><blockquote type="cite" class="">On Jan 23, 2016, at 5:34 AM, Dave Abrahams via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br class=""></blockquote><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">on Fri Jan 22 2016, Charles Srstka <</span><a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">> wrote:</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><blockquote type="cite" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><blockquote type="cite" class="">On Jan 21, 2016, at 1:25 PM, Tony Parker via swift-evolution<br class=""><<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br class=""><br class="">We surveyed the entire surface area of the iOS and OS X SDKs,<br class="">looking to see how many arguments typical methods had. We found that<br class=""></blockquote><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class="">the vast majority of methods actually have just one argument. If we<br class="">went with a rule that first arguments should be named, then methods<br class="">like:<br class=""><br class="">sayMessage(“hello”)<br class=""><br class="">would be this instead:<br class=""><br class="">say(message: “hello”)<br class=""><br class="">which isn’t really much of an improvement, in my mind.<br class=""></blockquote><br class="">How about making it so that methods with just one argument have no<br class="">label on the argument by default, but methods with two or more<br class="">arguments have labels on all arguments? This would prevent what you<br class="">describe above, while eliminating the ugliness of one parameter being<br class="">treated differently from all the rest in the same method.<br class=""></blockquote><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">...and replace it with the ugliness of one parameter being treated</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">differently from two. It would also force me to write "_" explicitly on</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">the first parameter of all of my 2+ parameter methods. Yes, it's a</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">little bit weird, but when optimizing APIs for readability at the call</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">site, the defaults we have actually work in practice.</span></div></blockquote></div><br class=""><div class="">I’m playing devil’s advocate a bit, here—but is being forced to write “_” on a parameter any more onerous than being forced to write the entire label name out twice?</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Charles</div><div class=""><br class=""></div></div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>swift-evolution mailing list</span><br><span><a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org">swift-evolution@swift.org</a></span><br><span><a href="https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution">https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution</a></span><br></div></blockquote></body></html>