<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class=""><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Jan 11, 2016, at 7:43 PM, Matthew Johnson via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">On Jan 11, 2016, at 7:33 PM, David Owens II <<a href="mailto:david@owensd.io" class="">david@owensd.io</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">On Jan 10, 2016, at 7:44 PM, Matthew Johnson via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div class="" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;"><div class="">I have always considered the Flexible Memberwise Initialization proposal to be just a first step (as evidenced by the many future enhancements it discussed). Its review has inspired new ideas and helped to shape my vision of the best long-term solution. My final thoughts about the review can be found here: <a href="https://lists.swift.org/pipermail/swift-evolution/Week-of-Mon-20160104/006176.html" class="">https://lists.swift.org/pipermail/swift-evolution/Week-of-Mon-20160104/006176.html</a></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Partial initializers is the second in a series of three proposals describing general features that can work together to form a complete solution.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><div class="">The proposal drafts can be found at the following links:</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">* <b class="">Parameter forwarding:</b> <a href="https://github.com/anandabits/swift-evolution/blob/parameter-forwarding/proposals/NNNN-parameter-forwarding.md" class="">https://github.com/anandabits/swift-evolution/blob/parameter-forwarding/proposals/NNNN-parameter-forwarding.md</a></div><div class="">* <b class="">Partial initializers:</b> <a href="https://github.com/anandabits/swift-evolution/blob/partial-initializers/proposals/NNNN-partial-initializers.md" class="">https://github.com/anandabits/swift-evolution/blob/partial-initializers/proposals/NNNN-partial-initializers.md</a></div><div class="">* <b class="">Property lists:</b> <a href="https://github.com/anandabits/swift-evolution/blob/property-lists/proposals/NNNN-property-lists.md" class="">https://github.com/anandabits/swift-evolution/blob/property-lists/proposals/NNNN-property-lists.md</a></div></div><div class=""><br class=""></div></div></div></blockquote></div><br class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">The biggest drawback I see is that is doesn’t really address the ability to use normal functions to initialize the state of the type. For example, in order to implement a “reset” or “clear” mechanism, I still need to duplicate a bunch of init code.</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><blockquote class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; margin: 0px 0px 0px 40px; border: none; padding: 0px;"><div class=""><font face="Menlo" class="">class CFoo {<br class=""> private(set) var value: Int<br class=""> <br class=""> func reset() {<br class=""> value = 0<br class=""> }<br class=""> <br class=""> init() {<br class=""> // Really want to just call this...<br class=""> //reset()<br class=""> <br class=""> // But, instead, I need to duplicate the code from `reset()`<br class=""> value = 0<br class=""> }<br class=""> <br class=""> func inc() {<br class=""> ++value<br class=""> }<br class="">}<br class=""><br class="">let c = CFoo()<br class="">c.inc()<br class="">c.value // 1<br class="">c.reset()<br class="">c.value // 0<br class=""></font><br class=""></div></blockquote><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">Take the above code, the “init” functionality is really about putting the type in the correct state. I think I’d rather see a mechanism to make a non-initializer as adhering to the rules of an init() so that it could be used in multiple contexts. </div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">I think this modification makes your proposal much more interesting and applicable to more use cases.</div><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div></div></blockquote><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">That is a fair point. </div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">The reason I didn’t go that route has a lot to do with `let` properties. It would feel weird to me to be assigning to a `let` in a non-init method (that is why I didn’t like Joe’s tuple property idea). And a method that does that couldn’t be called any other time anyway.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Maybe we could introduce partial inits as well as an attribute or decl modifier for methods that have similar behavior to partial inits, but are not allowed to assign to a `let` property (maybe @init). I could add something along those lines to this proposal or it could be a separate follow-on proposal.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">What do you think of that? </div></div></div></blockquote><div><br class=""></div><div>Actually, another solution to this would be to just allow partial initializers that don’t initialize `let` properties to be called post-initialization. They have identifiers so they could be called like a normal method after initialization completes. </div><div><br class=""></div><div>I kind of like this idea better because it emphasizes the fact that they are initializing state and not doing anything else. It sets them apart from normal methods. It also avoids the need for more syntax.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Attempting to call a partial init that does initialize a `let` property post-initialization would be a compiler error.</div><div><br class=""></div><div>Matthew</div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">Matthew</div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><div class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">-David</div></div></blockquote></div><br class="" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><img src="https://u2002410.ct.sendgrid.net/wf/open?upn=eLFMrKDT8iBxZ-2Fbnk-2BZqvSchNN-2FvYXdceA0T7VxwkAccnppjfEzEg-2FKqtp4NlbkQZyjf9jgHvhuFH2Krm3-2Fp1IbRFCMjJCD-2BQbBwC6P002OrewcZbfLtnZy4r7PT-2FbKgXNwFnTIBs0-2FGszFbJv2GKKidzf97DQQ6bI3EWNbF475I-2BwhgewQo-2FQ8KW-2BSRdQqV8dQQKyArpRrp8caNo9yJ6N5V7tbwfCT8L-2FkzUctMKNE-3D" alt="" width="1" height="1" border="0" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; height: 1px !important; width: 1px !important; border-width: 0px !important; margin: 0px !important; padding: 0px !important;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class=""><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>_______________________________________________</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><span style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">swift-evolution mailing list</span><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a><br style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><a href="https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution" style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution</a></div></blockquote></div><br class=""></body></html>