<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div></div><div>I've always thought that, </div><div><br></div><div>if let foo = foo? {</div><div><br></div><div>}</div><div><br></div><div>makes more sense than </div><div><br></div><div>if let foo = foo {</div><div><br></div><div>}</div><div><br></div><div>as the ? indicates that you are unwrapping the optional and then assigning it to the new variable</div><div><br>On Dec 19, 2015, at 7:02 PM, Cihat Gündüz via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=utf-8"><div class="">I’ve only read the last couple of posts but has anybody already suggested using something like this:</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">if let foo! {</div><div class=""> // code that uses foo</div><div class="">}</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">People already know that the ! is unwrapping a value and that let is defining a new constant. So why not combine those two?</div><div class="">Alternatively it could also be:</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">if let foo? {</div><div class=""> // code that uses foo</div><div class="">}</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">What do you think?</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">– Cihat</div><br class=""><div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">Am 19.12.2015 um 23:43 schrieb Dave Abrahams via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>>:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">On Dec 19, 2015, at 2:15 PM, Radosław Pietruszewski via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">I was going to suggest something similar (a hard naming problem also):</div><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">if has foo {</div><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"> // foo is now unwrapped and non-optional</div><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">}</div><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">guard has foo else { return }</div><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">Does the same thing as `let foo = foo` in practice, but places it in a somewhat different mental model. Instead of unwrapping and immediately assigning to a new constant with the same name (which just looks kind of silly, like some magic voodoo ritual), it sort of asserts that we “have” foo (i.e. it’s not nil), and therefore from that point it can just be treated as non-optional.</div><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">IMHO this, although introduces a new keyword, makes more sense than trying to reuse “let” in a context where it seems nonsensical. Perhaps this would be closer to Swift’s goals, by reducing very common boilerplate, but without harming clarity in a way adding a new meaning to “let” would.</div><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><br class=""></div><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">Curious to hear Chris Lattner’s opinion :-) </div></div></blockquote><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">IANACL (I am not a Chris Lattner) but, FWIW, several of us are uncomfortable with the idea that a single declared property might have different static types in different regions of code.</div></div><div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=""><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><br class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="">— Radek</div></div><br class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class="" style="font-family: AvenirNext-Regular; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On 19 Dec 2015, at 21:31, Dennis Lysenko via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=""><p dir="ltr" class="">What if we made the keyword "unwrap"?<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></p><p dir="ltr" class="">if unwrap someViewController {<br class="">// now there is a shadowing nonoptional (unwrapped) variable of the same name only within this scope, boiling down to simple syntactic sugar for optional binding and it is fairly clear.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">}<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></p><br class=""><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="">On Sat, Dec 19, 2015, 1:31 PM Kevin Wooten via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br class=""></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; border-left-width: 1px; border-left-color: rgb(204, 204, 204); border-left-style: solid; padding-left: 1ex;"><div dir="auto" class=""><div class="">As much fun as it to example with foo, I would argue the opposite when you use some real world variable names:</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">if let someInterestingViewConroller =<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><span class="" style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">someInterestingViewConroller {</span></div><div class=""><span class="" style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">}</span></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">vs</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">If let <span class="" style="background-color: rgba(255, 255, 255, 0);">someInterestingViewConroller {</span></div><div class="">}</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">We know what let does and it should be enough to impart the necessary information for this statement.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">When it comes to newcomers I think you'd be hard pressed to find somebody who'd be able to understand either form without teaching; so not losing much there.<br class=""><br class=""></div></div><div dir="auto" class=""><div class=""><br class="">On Dec 19, 2015, at 10:01 AM, Chris Lattner via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" target="_blank" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br class=""><br class=""></div><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class=""><br class=""><div class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Dec 11, 2015, at 8:19 AM, Jeff Kelley via swift-evolution <<a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org" target="_blank" class="">swift-evolution@swift.org</a>> wrote:</div><br class=""><div class=""><div class="" style="word-wrap: break-word;">I’ve had similar ideas to this. Instead of ditching the<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><font face="Menlo" class="">if let</font><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>syntax altogether, another approach would be to use the existing name if no new name is given, so that this code:<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><font face="Menlo" class=""><span class="" style="white-space: pre-wrap;"> </span>if let foo = foo { /* use foo */ }</font></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">could become this code:</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class=""><font face="Menlo" class=""><span class="" style="white-space: pre-wrap;"> </span>if let foo { /* use foo */ }</font></div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">In both cases,<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><font face="Menlo" class="">foo</font><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>is non-optional inside the braces. If you gave it another name with the<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><font face="Menlo" class="">if let</font><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>syntax, that would work as it does today.<br class=""></div></div></div></blockquote><br class=""></div><div class="">Hi Jeff,</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">This is commonly requested - the problem is that while it does help reduce boilerplate, it runs counter to the goal of improving clarity.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">-Chris</div><br class=""><img src="https://u2002410.ct.sendgrid.net/wf/open?upn=1Ry8ov4zuU66O51YNcjYWXuMGf2gObG8uPwoJz-2B4Z1VqMdeyeesw-2Bc9SDkZTEmLmnofSO3tNgiMGF47sxE879Ut5x-2F6sLSrTgmZhXJOq-2B59bEaSmJ0a44hp5limyi-2FpsrcKvySjRuPP0gLr6FoeZNJoisevK-2BimrVdnhvmWcLj69rx67MHqizgTcdJrprVSbV2f-2FkGqilX9aSsmL60yEZg-3D-3D" alt="" width="1" height="1" border="0" class="" style="min-height: 1px !important; width: 1px !important; border-width: 0px !important; margin: 0px !important; 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</div></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>swift-evolution mailing list</span><br><span><a href="mailto:swift-evolution@swift.org">swift-evolution@swift.org</a></span><br><span><a href="https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution">https://lists.swift.org/mailman/listinfo/swift-evolution</a></span><br></div></blockquote></body></html>