<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div></div><div>I’m pinging some folks, but not everybody is back yet. I hope to resolve this ASAP.</div><div><br>On Jan 2, 2018, at 11:33 AM, Saleem Abdulrasool <<a href="mailto:compnerd@compnerd.org">compnerd@compnerd.org</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div dir="ltr">On Wed, Dec 20, 2017 at 4:26 PM, Ted Kremenek <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:kremenek@apple.com" target="_blank">kremenek@apple.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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On Dec 19, 2017, 8:33 PM -0800, Ted Kremenek via swift-dev <<a href="mailto:swift-dev@swift.org" target="_blank">swift-dev@swift.org</a>>, wrote:<br>
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On Dec 19, 2017, at 5:08 PM, Saleem Abdulrasool <<a href="mailto:compnerd@compnerd.org" target="_blank">compnerd@compnerd.org</a>> wrote:<br>
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<div>On Dec 19, 2017, at 3:59 PM, Ted Kremenek <<a href="mailto:kremenek@apple.com" target="_blank">kremenek@apple.com</a>> wrote:</div>
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<div>On Dec 19, 2017, at 2:31 PM, Daniel Dunbar <<a href="mailto:daniel_dunbar@apple.com" target="_blank">daniel_dunbar@apple.com</a>> wrote:</div>
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<div>On Dec 19, 2017, at 2:27 PM, Ted Kremenek <<a href="mailto:kremenek@apple.com" target="_blank">kremenek@apple.com</a>> wrote:</div>
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<div>We care about swiftc and llbuild building a variety of platforms today — FreeBSD, Rasberry Pi, etc. My impression is that C++14 is generally supported by both (a) the mininum versions of the distributions we support today and (b) the current versions of the platforms we’d like to expand Swift to in the future. Does that sound right? I suspect you went through the same kind of reasoning with llbuild.</div>
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It sounds reasonable, but to be honest I never did an audit of what platforms supported C++14.</div>
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<div>I do think that we could always use the Clang++ we build as part of Swift to build Swift itself. By that logic, it seems reasonable to expect we could always have C++14 support, although it does mean that porters would need modern Clang to support their platform. However, that is likely largely a prerequisite for Swift to work as well.</div>
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<div>Agreed. However, the current supported platforms already support this minimum. I think that future platforms will need to provide that anyways. If the system doesn’t have a modern toolchain available, I suspect that it already would not have C++11 available either. In such a scenario, they need to provide a newer toolchain, and so the difference there is minimal as we already require C++11.</div>
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<div>OK, I’m convinced.</div>
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<div>I want to hold off for a tiny bit just to see if anyone else has any commentary on this thread before we make a change. </div>
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</span><div>We’d also need to make this change on the LLDB side, and I realize now that a few people I’d like to weigh in are on vacation until the holidays. How about we pick this up immediately in the new year once it’s clear everyone that should weigh in has had a chance to do so.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Just a post-holiday bump to bring this back up :-). I'd like to get this merged so that the other Windows stuff is unblocked.</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div name="messageReplySection" style="font-size:14px;font-family:-apple-system,BlinkMacSystemFont,sans-serif"><div><div class="h5">
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<div> - Daniel</div>
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On Dec 19, 2017, 2:23 PM -0800, Daniel Dunbar <<a href="mailto:daniel_dunbar@apple.com" target="_blank">daniel_dunbar@apple.com</a>>, wrote:<br>
<blockquote type="cite" style="margin:5px 5px;padding-left:10px;border-left:thin solid #2ecc71">It wasn’t changed, it has *always* been C++14 since the day we open sourced it. I only investigated the platforms we officially support (Ubuntu 14.04/15.10 at the time, and macOS 10.10+ IIRC).<br>
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<blockquote type="cite" style="margin:5px 5px;padding-left:10px;border-left:thin solid #9b59b6">On Dec 19, 2017, at 2:21 PM, Ted Kremenek <<a href="mailto:kremenek@apple.com" target="_blank">kremenek@apple.com</a>> wrote:<br>
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Daniel,<br>
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When you changed llbuild to require C++14, what platforms did you take into account with that change? If you have already done the assessment here it could speed a resolution of a decision.<br>
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<blockquote type="cite" style="margin:5px 5px;padding-left:10px;border-left:thin solid #e74c3c">On Dec 13, 2017, at 3:19 PM, Daniel Dunbar via swift-lldb-dev <<a href="mailto:swift-lldb-dev@swift.org" target="_blank">swift-lldb-dev@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br>
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FWIW, llbuild requires C++14.<br>
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We have to do some minor shenanigans to workaround bugs in libstdc++ on 14.04, and our use is probably minimal, but just throwing that out there.<br>
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<blockquote type="cite" style="margin:5px 5px;padding-left:10px;border-left:thin solid #1abc9c">On Dec 13, 2017, at 1:45 PM, Jordan Rose via swift-lldb-dev <<a href="mailto:swift-lldb-dev@swift.org" target="_blank">swift-lldb-dev@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br>
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No one else has commented on this yet today, so I'll put in that I don't have any objections to this and don't foresee any major problems. The one place where we'd need to be careful is with LLDB, which imports Swift headers; if Swift is going to move to C++14, then Swift-LLDB probably has to as well. LLDB folks, what do you think?<br>
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The other thing to check is if our minimum Clang or libstdc++ requirements on Linux didn't support C++14. It looks like our README is vague on that, but LLDB already suggests a minimum requirement of Clang 3.5, which is new enough. I suspect we're okay here.<br>
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<blockquote type="cite" style="margin:5px 5px;padding-left:10px;border-left:thin solid #e67e22">On Dec 13, 2017, at 10:36, Saleem Abdulrasool via swift-dev <<a href="mailto:swift-dev@swift.org" target="_blank">swift-dev@swift.org</a>> wrote:<br>
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Hi,<br>
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The newer Windows SDK requires the use of C++14 (the SDK headers use `auto` return types without trailing type information). Joe mentioned that there was some interest in switching the rest of swift to C++14 as well. I figured that I would just start a thread here to determine if this is okay to do globally rather than just specifically for the Windows builds to ensure that we can build the Windows components.<br>
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Thanks.<br>
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--<br>
Saleem Abdulrasool<br>
compnerd (at) compnerd (dot) org<br>
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</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">Saleem Abdulrasool<br>compnerd (at) compnerd (dot) org</div>
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