<html><head><style>body{font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px}</style></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;"><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">Yes we can most definitely tag images for snapshots. Maybe our versioning could reflect that too.</div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;"><br></div><div id="bloop_customfont" style="font-family:Helvetica,Arial;font-size:13px; color: rgba(0,0,0,1.0); margin: 0px; line-height: auto;">Haris</div> <br><p class="airmail_on">On January 4, 2016 at 1:17:56 PM, Thomas Catterall (<a href="mailto:me@swizzlr.co">me@swizzlr.co</a>) wrote:</p> <blockquote type="cite" class="clean_bq"><span><div dir="auto"><div></div><div>
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<div>Hi Daniel,</div>
<div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div>
<div id="AppleMailSignature">We'd release new images as new
snapshots are released; we don't do it yet but we can "tag" images
so that you could pin your image to a particular snapshot.</div>
<div id="AppleMailSignature"><br></div>
<div id="AppleMailSignature">Tom<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone</div>
<div><br>
On 4 Jan 2016, at 12:24, Daniel Dunbar <<a href="mailto:daniel_dunbar@apple.com">daniel_dunbar@apple.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br></div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>Hi Thomas,
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class="">Just a question: how would the constant changing of
the Swift compiler version and language interact with this? It
seems odd to have an "official" version of what is an otherwise
unreleased language version/compiler.</div>
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class=""> - Daniel</div>
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class="">
<div>
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On Dec 29, 2015, at 10:07 AM, Thomas Catterall via
swift-dev <<a href="mailto:swift-dev@swift.org" class="">swift-dev@swift.org</a>> wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class="">
<div dir="auto" class="">
<div class="">Hi all,</div>
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class="">You might want to settle down with a glass of eggnog
to read this, it's a long one.</div>
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class="">Myself and Haris Amin (CC'd), as you may know, have
been building a community of users who want to use Swift inside
Docker containers (<a href="https://github.com/swiftdocker/docker-swift" class="">https://github.com/swiftdocker/docker-swift</a>) and maintain an
image, swiftdocker/swift, that provides a complete Swift
installation that is usable for all kinds of applications, from
trying a Linux REPL to running a webserver (I've already deployed
one).</div>
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class="">We've been contacted by a content evangelist at
Docker who would like to offer an "official" Docker image that
contains Swift. You can read more about official Docker images
here: <a href="https://docs.docker.com/docker-hub/official_repos/" class="">https://docs.docker.com/docker-hub/official_repos/</a>. Note
that these are official in Docker Inc.'s view: they don't
necessarily exist as officially supported by, for instance, PyPy
developers, but they are a great starting point and exhibit best
practices. Docker is interested in having Haris and I maintain the
image we have been building as the official repository. There's a
lot of benefits to having an official Docker image, namely enhanced
security, scrutiny, support, and a spotlight on a great new
language that can drive adoption.</div>
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class="">Haris and I are incredibly thankful for the hard work
Swift's core team have put into the open sourcing of the language
and in that spirit we are very reluctant to proceed without the
core team's blessing. The important thing to note is that this
endeavour would involve little to no work on the core team's side,
except perhaps a note on the Downloads page saying that this is a
community supported project and not one officially supported by the
core team.</div>
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class="">This brings to a head something that's been rumbling
for a while: how exactly does the Swift Project "bless" alternative
distributions or platforms? For instance, the recent work on
compiling to ARM for the Raspberry Pi is a worthy project, notably
for the Pi's adoption in educational environments. BSD systems are
another area of great interest. Furthermore, I doubt it will be
long before someone wants to provide a Swift package through
apt-get, homebrew etc. While those contributors may have less
qualms about wanting the Swift team's blessing, it makes sense that
there is some degree of centrality to ensure people do not work
independently towards the same goal for a particular
platform.</div>
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class="">For the matter at hand, Haris and I would like to at
the least hear "go for it" from the core team; better yet, we'd
love to have anyone from the core team/Apple who is interested in
Docker/the build infrastructure to join Haris, Docker and I in
creating this official repo, and serving as a representative of
Apple's interests in this area.</div>
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class="">For the larger matter, it seems to me that the Swift
Project can take a few directions:</div>
<div class="">1. "Knock yourselves out, but we're just making the
language." In this direction, the Swift Project would disclaim
official support or blessing of anything that doesn't come out of
it. Occupation of a top level namespace or being the "official"
Swift for a platform would be something for the community to sort
out independently with the platform vendor.</div>
<div class="">2. "Knock yourselves out, here's a list of all the
current efforts that we think you might be interested in"</div>
<div class="">Not so much as blessing, still disclaiming support,
but at the least acknowledging the ecosystem around Swift for other
platforms besides OS X and the two Ubuntus.</div>
<div class="">3. Blessing: in this direction, which I think a lot
of people would like and I would prefer, the Swift project gives
its blessing to projects, and links to them on its website. This
has the benefit of centralising development efforts and providing
an easy springboard for those who are interested in Swift and are
checking the website.</div>
<div class="">4. Official support: in this direction, when a
project meets a certain criteria, it is folded into the main Swift
project, given a repo on GitHub etc. This would probably not occur
for quite a while yet, but as continuous integration improves for
Swift it could make sense that the docker image might be something
that is actively supported in the development of Swift if it is
sufficiently popular.</div>
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class="">I'd like to hear back from the core team about this
instance of the Docker issue, but I'd also like to start a
conversation about community platform support and how centralising
issues like this one can be handled in future.</div>
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class="">Best wishes for the new year,</div>
<div class=""><br class=""></div>
<div class="">Thomas Catterall</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
<br class="">
Sent from my iPhone</div>
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